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- Sailboat Reviews
C&C 27 Boat Review
With hundreds still sailing, the 27 is an affordable option in cruiser-racer market..
This fast and handsome cruiser/racer from the 1970s is an excellent example of what made C&C Yachts such a successful company. C&C stands for George Cuthbertson & George Cassian, the design team that, in 1969, joined in partnership with Belleville Marine Yard, Hinterhoeller Ltd. and Bruckmann Manufacturing to form C&C Yachts. The company had a tumultuous history, from growing to capture an estimated 20 percent of the U.S. market during the 1970s, to suffering a devastating fire in 1994 while owned by Hong Kong businessmen Anthony Koo and Frank Chow of Wa Kwang Shipping. Along the way, they built a tremendous number of boats, not only in the racer/cruiser genre that was their mtier, but also the Landfall cruiser line, and a few oddballs such as the 1977 Mega 30 with a retractable fin keel; the Mega 30 and a handful of others simply bombed.
Most boats were built at one of several Ontario, Canada, facilities, but short periods of construction also took place in Middletown, R.I., and Kiel, Germany. In 1998, Fairport Marine, which owned Tartan Marine, purchased the C&C name and some molds and moved the remnants to Ohio. Other than the name and the emphasis on performance, however, there is no tangible connection between that more modern C&C and the giant of 25 years ago that so dominated the North American yachting scene.
The C&C 27 followed quickly on the heels of the successful C&C 35. The design dates to 1970, with the first boats coming off the line in 1971. C&C tweaked the design through four versions of the original 27-the Mark I, II, III and IV-but the hulls were very similar. The C&C 27s production ended in 1982 after nearly 1,000 had been built. From 1984 to 1987, C&C offered the Mark V, which was an MORC-influenced 27-footer with an outboard rudder; its design strayed far from the Mark I, II, III, and IV, and it should not be confused with the previous editions.
The 27 is a good example of what made C&C successful-contemporary good looks with sharp, crisp lines that still hold appeal today. The sheerline is handsome. Below the waterline, the swept-back appendages are dated, but thats of little significance to most owners. In the Mark I version, the partially balanced spade rudder is angled aft, with a good portion of it protruding behind the transom. In one of his reviews for Sailing magazine, designer Robert Perry described the C&C 27s rudder as a scimitar shape that was long in the chord and shallow. In 1974, when the Mark IV was born, the rudder was redesigned with a constant chord length and much greater depth and less sweep angle.
The keel, too, was redesigned in 1974, though most were swept aft like an inverted sharks fin. The Mark IIIs keel was given 2 inches more depth and the maximum thickness was moved forward to delay stalling. Hydrodynamic considerations aside, the worst that can be said of the 27s keel is that it takes extra care in blocking when the boat is hauled and set down on jack stands. Without a flat run on the bottom of the keel, the boat wants to rock forward.
Through its evolution, the C&C 27 not only gained draft, but it gained length overall as well: Both marks I and II were 27 feet, 4 inches long (21 feet at waterline), while marks III and IV were 27 feet, 10.5 inches from stem to stern (22 feet, 11 inches at waterline). The bow overhang is attractive, but more than what is found on most boats nowadays. Remember that waterline length directly affects speed.
All editions have a 9-foot, 2-inch beam, but displacement changed over the years-from 5,180 pounds to 5,500 pounds and then 5,800 pounds. And with the Mark III, the design shed about 400 pounds of ballast.
The later models rigs were masthead sloops with a mainsail luff length (P) of 28 feet, 6 inches and a foot length (E) of 10 feet, 6 inches; this gives an aspect ratio of .36. Rig height on the Mark I was 33 feet, and the Mark II had a 35-foot-tall rig.
Depending on which waterline dimension you use, the displacement/length ratio (D/L) ranges from 211 to 237. The sail/area displacement ratio (SA/D) is between 17.3 and 19.4. With moderate displacement and a generous sail plan, the C&C 27 is swift. PHRF ratings for the Mark I average around 200 seconds per mile, dropping to about 195 for the Mark II and 180 for the Mark III.
According to the C&C 27 owners association, C&C Yachts used only the Mark I and Mark II designations-the first for the original hull-form and the latter for a stretched and subtly reshaped development from the original. However, C&C 27 sailors added the other designations to distinguish between the different models, particularly for racing ratings.
About half of the C&C 27 owners use the boat strictly for cruising, while the other half also enjoy some club racing aboard the boat. Racing fleets are larger in Canada than the U.S., but they can be found in significant numbers on the West Coast and in the Great Lakes as well. There is a rather active owners association, and the groups website (see Resources) offers technical information, manuals, links to vendors for C&C 27 parts, as well as a forum for owners Q&A.
For more on the differences between the various models, see the accompanying The Evolution of the C&C 27 Cruiser-racer .
Construction
C&C Yachts was a pioneer in balsa sandwich construction, but the early C&C 27s had solid-glass hulls. Decks were balsa-cored. An old brochure says the marine-ply bulkheads are taped and bonded to hull and deck, though photos show a headliner, which seems to make deck tabbing not possible. The same brochure says fiberglass is hand-laid-up, using alternate layers of mat and cloth; no mention is made of woven roving, which is commonly used to add thickness quickly.
During this period, C&C used a molded fiberglass pan that incorporated the cabin sole and berth foundations, but did not extend higher. The berth/settee backs, and galley and head cabinetry are plywood, and access to parts of the hull is generally good.
Ballast is an external lead casting through-bolted to reinforced hull sections.
In our survey of C&C 27 owners, one owner said that the cabin sole needs supporting timbers underneath. One trick that C&C used in lieu of floors was to lay in thick bands of fiberglass athwartship (about 6 inches wide). These started on one side of the hull, crossed the bilge, and went up the other side.
A C&C trademark was the L-shaped aluminum toerail with slots for attaching snatch blocks. Of equal benefit was the ability to use carriage bolts for the hull-deck joint, which could be installed by one person rather than two. Other builders quickly copied this feature.
For weekending and coastal cruising, there is a lot to like in the light, rigid C&C 27, but many C&Cs have weak spots that would need to be addressed for offshore work: bulkheads not tabbed to the deck (which may result in the deck lifting as the boat and rig work); thin laminates in the outboard edges of the sidedecks where stanchion bases are bolted; absence of backing plates on pulpits; and thin portlight lenses that should be replaced or fitted with storm shutters.
And, as with any older boat, prospective buyers should check for bulkhead rot where the chainplates attach (water runs down the plate and through the deck, which is difficult to seal) and for delamination of the decks, especially around hardware, whose bedding may have disappeared years ago. Rebedding deck fittings is a boring job, but a very important one because the balsa core is at risk. It is made easier-and less boring-if you have a helper (one of you on deck, the other below). You don’t have to do everything the first year; start with the worst fittings and do them in groups, at least a few each year.
Twenty-seven feet is in many respects a magic number for a sailboat. At this length, it is possible to have standing headroom without distorting the boats proportions beyond all good taste, and to have an inboard engine, with its obvious advantages and status. Headroom around the 27 is between 5 feet, 10 inches and 6 feet, 2 inches.
The accommodation plan is plain vanilla, tried and true: 6-foot-plus V-berth forward, head and hanging locker, dinette with opposing settee, and aft galley. Without a quarterberth, the 27s cockpit seat lockers provide valuable and generous stowage for lines, fenders, barbecue and cleaning supplies, and all the other stuff that goes with sailing.
Testers liked that there is a bridgedeck, which we think is a sensible choice as it a) helps keep water out of the cabin in the event the boat is pooped; b) provides additional seating in the cockpit; and c) offers additional space in the galley.
A lot of C&Cs were not particularly well ventilated, and the 27 is no exception. The big windows in the main saloon are fixed. Most air will enter from the forward hatch, which on a small boat in northern latitudes may be adequate, but hardly ideal for southern sailing. A dorade vent over the head was an option.
Performance
The C&C 27 was one of the companys most popular designs, and much of this was due to its smart handling and good turn of speed. Not surprisingly, owners generally rate its upwind and off-the-wind performance as above average.
Several owners we surveyed said that light air is the Mark Is Achilles heel and that a large genoa of more than 150 percent is necessary to stay competitive. In 1974, the rig was lengthened 3 feet and sail area increased from 348 to 372 square feet.
The boat handles easily. Turns 360 degrees within its own length, said one owner of a 1973 model.
Extremely well balanced, wrote another owner.
The only negative comment made by owners concerned increasing weather helm as the wind builds; they advised reefing early. The owner of a 1971 model explained, The Mark III has a high-aspect rudder; the original rudder gives the boat extremely bad weather helm.
Points very high, wrote the owner of hull No. 146. Shes easily controlled off the wind. If sail is reduced intelligently, shes a dream to drive. Rock solid at about 18 degrees.
Early models featured mainsheet sheeting at the end of the boom, but in 1974, the standard setup was changed to mid-boom sheeting with the traveler on the bridgedeck.
The 27s auxiliary power ranged from an Atomic 4 gasoline engine to a two-cylinder Yanmar diesel. Most owners have reported that their boats back up beautifully. Best backing boat Ive seen, said the owner of a 1977 model. Comments on engine accessibility also ran the gamut, ranging from easy to ridiculous-which may say more about the size of the respondents than anything else.
With prices ranging from $10,000 to $20,000 (some with a trailer), the C&C 27 represents a fair value-standing headroom for most, berths for four (owners say the dinette is a bit narrow for a double when converted), and an inboard engine. The Yanmars of the late models are preferred over the old Atomic 4, but many of the boats on the market today have been re-powered.
Potential buyers should pay particular attention to the pulpit and stanchion bases and the surrounding fiberglass for signs of cracks; and check the deck core and the interior support structure that handles mast compression for signs of rot.
Boats built after 1974 (Mark III) seem to sail better thanks to the incorporated refinements-new rudder, deeper keel, taller rig, added shrouds, etc.
Of the many owner comments weve heard about the boat, one in particular rings particularly true: Simple systems, easy to maintain. That means owners wont spend an arm and a leg trying to keep the C&C 27 afloat, and that has a great deal of appeal for us.
- The Evolution of the C&C 27 Cruiser-Racer
- C&C 27 Owners
- C&C Photo Album
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CS27 vs C&C27
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So I might be having a slight bit of 3-footitis, any opinions on the above two boats? Both seem to be of a similar quality, both sail well (from what I've heard).
Tough call..... The CS 27 is well known for construction quality, and sails well, esp upwind. The C&C 27 might be considered the 'prettier' boat, it's hard to beat the classic C&C sheerline, and personally I prefer C&C's hull deck joint treatment. I think you'll find that cockpit-wise they are similar, the C&C may have a marginal edge in interior space and wider side decks for moving forward. Both have aluminum framed ports (C&C in earlier editions) that can be prone to leakage, but so can the bonded lenses on later C&Cs. IMO the newer bonded, tinted ports update the look of the C&C substantially. The CS seems marginally powered if you have the original horizontal Yanmar, a friend has trouble powering much more than 4-4.5 knots, but there could be other issues at play there. Many C&Cs have A4s, which I don't believe CS ever did (but could be wrong about that) so that's another comparison point. Don't think you could go wrong with a good example of either...
Faster said: Tough call..... The CS 27 is well known for construction quality, and sails well, esp upwind. The C&C 27 might be considered the 'prettier' boat, it's hard to beat the classic C&C sheerline, and personally I prefer C&C's hull deck joint treatment. I think you'll find that cockpit-wise they are similar, the C&C may have a marginal edge in interior space and wider side decks for moving forward. Both have aluminum framed ports (C&C in earlier editions) that can be prone to leakage, but so can the bonded lenses on later C&Cs. IMO the newer bonded, tinted ports update the look of the C&C substantially. The CS seems marginally powered if you have the original horizontal Yanmar, a friend has trouble powering much more than 4-4.5 knots, but there could be other issues at play there. Many C&Cs have A4s, which I don't believe CS ever did (but could be wrong about that) so that's another comparison point. Don't think you could go wrong with a good example of either... Click to expand...
I would love a 30, but that's 10k more at a minimum. There's a CS27 locally to me for under $10k, and a couple of C&C27s for a similar amount across the strait. That just puts them into "affordable" territory.
You cant go wrong with either of them. Go for the one in best condition.
SNer mitiempo is near you, Paul, and lives aboard a CS27... hopefully he'll chime in for you, or have you met/talked to him already?
The deck core of the C&C27 is a significant weak point. Yet the 8hp diesel of CS27 is lacking speed and power, especially on the ocean. Take the C&C with the rebuilt or dry deck core only.
The CS is a bit bigger boat - 1/2 ton more Disp, 1/2 a foot more beam & a foot more W/L. Both are good old boats but I find the CS boats seem to hold up a smidge better over time. There are a couple of donated C&C 27's at Harbour Yachts - or are those the ones you referred to?
CS only offered Yanmar diesels in this model, different Yanmars over the production run. Side decks are narrow but design allowed for walking on cabin side under sail. Check the head door - it's a love/hate thing. When you stand in the passageway between main & forward cabin, turn to face the door on port, slip both barrel bolts then turn aft and the door will block off main cabin. Head sink slides in/out. They are both simply built nuts n bolts boats. CS always offered welded bow and stern rails rather than the socket and tee units on earlier C & C's. Gibb winches on earlier CS (later Lewmar) vs Barient. CS had a cheap painted steel fuel tank strapped underneath the cockpit. The last year we built them a few were built with Beckson opening ports. You have/had a C & C 24? You'll see the similarities in the 27's. Both good choices, subject to viewing, survey, owner maintenance and updates. Happy Sailing!
Seems like the folks sailing C&C 27's are having a ball. The boat appears to have just the right mix to be able to race in light winds and cruise in heavier stuff. The C&C Association BBS is alive and kicking making for a bit of fun cult following. Not sure if the CS27 & C&C30 have the same chemistry. I'm close to buying a C&C 27 myself with the added possibility that if I have to trailer the old girl myself for storage, it is doable. Has the YSM12 which I think is gem. Best Regards
Well I went to take a look at the CS27 up the road from me. All was going well until we got to the bulkheads, the port chainplate is leaking and that bulkhead is starting to rot, and the bulkhead between the v-berth and the hanging locker on the starboard side was shot. The rest of the boat was OK, plenty of cosmetics needed, new cushions, running rigging etc but otherwise fairly decent. It looked like a boat forgotten by its owner for a couple of years, and unfortunately those couple of years don't look like they've been kind to it. Shame as otherwise it seemed a nicely laid out boat. Any thoughts on this? 27ft Paceship sailboat
There are a couple of donated C&C 27's at Harbour Yachts - or are those the ones you referred to? Click to expand...
Not really. I see them when I drop by Race Rock. Nothing nasty jumps out at me but they need a lot of cosmetic love. They are donations and have been sitting there for quite a while so I imagine you could try a pretty low offer. Ray has a Grampian 30 for the same price range as well - also a donation. I'll take a look at them when I'm down there next - probably tomorrow,
That's be great Jon, thanks. I see they also have a yellow C&C30 just listed, any chance of a quick peek at that if you have a minute? Cosmetic stuff I can handle, not scared to get busy scrubbing and buffing, even new cushions etc aren't too much to worry about.
"Trincomali' used to belong to Steve Tupper, former head of BC Sailing...
I'm going to have a quick look tomorrow, I'm over on the mainland for some meetings so will scoot out to west van. As long as the boat is basically sound then I can always add things as I go along, at least that way I know exactly what they are and how old they are. Also helps that I can get a bunch of stuff at cost, including a new engine if necessary.
The Paceship PY26 has a good reputation. Mine is a P29. But the one you are looking at is a little jewel, and may be priced well above the average market value. I find the C&C30to be a large boat. Possibly too large if the wife never gets comfortable sailing.
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CS 27 Detailed Review
If you are a boat enthusiast looking to get more information on specs, built, make, etc. of different boats, then here is a complete review of CS 27. Built by CS Yachts (Canadian Sailcraft) and designed by Raymond Wall, the boat was first built in 1975. It has a hull type of Fin w/transom hung rudder and LOA is 8.23. Its sail area/displacement ratio 16.39. Its auxiliary power tank, manufactured by Yanmar, runs on Diesel.
CS 27 has retained its value as a result of superior building, a solid reputation, and a devoted owner base. Read on to find out more about CS 27 and decide if it is a fit for your boating needs.
Boat Information
Boat specifications, sail boat calculation, rig and sail specs, auxillary power tank, contributions, who designed the cs 27.
CS 27 was designed by Raymond Wall.
Who builds CS 27?
CS 27 is built by CS Yachts (Canadian Sailcraft).
When was CS 27 first built?
CS 27 was first built in 1975.
How long is CS 27?
CS 27 is 7.29 m in length.
What is mast height on CS 27?
CS 27 has a mast height of 9.14 m.
Member Boats at HarborMoor
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COMMENTS
Ballast: 2800 lbs./1270 kgs. Sail Area/Disp.: 15.71. Bal./Disp.: 43.08%;Disp./Len.: 212.02. About 90 boats were fitted with these lead fins. In 1977, the rudder area was increased. CS also offered owners a rudder retrofit kit that added two inches to the forward edge to improve helm balance.
The CS 27 is a small recreational keelboat, built predominantly of fibreglass.It has a masthead sloop rig, a transom-hung rudder and a fixed fin keel.It displaces 6,100 lb (2,767 kg) and carries 2,400 lb (1,089 kg) of ballast. [1] [2]The boat has a draft of 5.17 ft (1.58 m) with the standard iron-ballasted keel and 3.92 ft (1.19 m) with the optional longer shoal draft lead-ballasted keel.
The C&C 27 followed quickly on the heels of the successful C&C 35. The design dates to 1970, with the first boats coming off the line in 1971. C&C tweaked the design through four versions of the original 27-the Mark I, II, III and IV-but the hulls were very similar. The C&C 27s production ended in 1982 after nearly 1,000 had been built.
If those pictures are of the interior of the boat you are looking at and are current then she is rather nice as a family boat to race and cruise and weekend with. The diesel makes a bit of a racket but all engines are noisy compared to sail. ... On the other hand, you are talking about a potential of a boat that rates half the CS 27. (PHRF 99 ...
19468 posts · Joined 2005. #2 · Mar 2, 2013. Tough call..... The CS 27 is well known for construction quality, and sails well, esp upwind. The C&C 27 might be considered the 'prettier' boat, it's hard to beat the classic C&C sheerline, and personally I prefer C&C's hull deck joint treatment. I think you'll find that cockpit-wise they are ...
CS 27 is a 27′ 0″ / 8.2 m monohull sailboat designed by Raymond Wall and built by CS Yachts (Canadian Sailcraft) between 1975 and 1983. ... The lower a boat's ratio is, the less power it takes to drive the boat to its nominal hull speed or beyond. Read more. Formula. D/L = (D ÷ 2240) ÷ (0.01 x LWL)³ D: Displacement of the boat in pounds ...
The Cs 27 is a 27.0ft masthead sloop designed by Raymond Wall and built in fiberglass by CS Yachts (Canadian Sailcraft) between 1975 and 1983. 480 units have been built. The Cs 27 is a light sailboat which is a reasonably good performer. It is stable / stiff and has a low righting capability if capsized. It is best suited as a day-boat.
Are you searching for a second-hand boat for under $20,000, with a diesel inboard, a comfortable interior, standing headroom and good club-racing performance? In my opinion, there are few well-known production boats that meet this description. The Mirage 26/27, for example, has a gas OMC Saildrive inboard; the C&C 27 has the Atomic IV (also gasoline) inboard. And although the Bayfield 25 has ...
1977 27' CS 27 sailboat for sale in Pultneyville NY Lake Ontario New York. Home. Register & Post. View All Sailboats. ... Fusion Marine Stereo (2011), interior speakers. Log-speedometer (2011 Raymarine ST60 ) Autopilot (2011 Raymarine SmartPilot X-5) ... CS Sailboats CS 27s New York CSs. Featured Sailboats: Home. Register & Post. View All ...
1977. 27'. 9.3'. 5.2'. Outside United States. $. Description: CS Yachts very popular 27-foot sloop, fiberglass hull, 5'2"- draft, 9'3"- beam, inboard Yanmar engine 8HP, can accommodate of five of people, standing headroom, comfortable interior and a good sailing performance she's an excellent value; washroom, hanging locker, life jackets-4, 2 ...
27'. 9.4'. 3.9'. New York. $13,500. Description: Motivated to sell, make an offer today! With standing headroom, a comfortable interior, and excellent sailing performance she's an excellent value. Boat is in excellent condition, sails well, particularly well-suited for end of season (Sept, Oct, Nov) heavy, steady winds.
The C&C 27. By Paul Howard. August 11, 2002. Of all the designs produced by C&C Yachts over more than two decades, the C&C 27 was overwhelmingly its most successful. It had the longest production run - more than a decade - and the highest volume of sales - nearly 1,000. It was also one of the first designs created by the new company, preceded ...
Built by CS Yachts (Canadian Sailcraft) and designed by Raymond Wall, the boat was first built in 1975. It has a hull type of Fin w/transom hung rudder and LOA is 8.23. Its sail area/displacement ratio 16.39. Its auxiliary power tank, manufactured by Yanmar, runs on Diesel. CS 27 has retained its value as a result of superior building, a solid ...
The C&C 27 (MK I-IV) was one of C&C Yachts most successful model. Almost 1000 were built over a period of nearly 10 years. (Until 1982) Mark I (hulls 1-167) (shown here) Mark II (168-452), produced from 1972 to 1974. Same dimensions as Mark I, except for a taller rig though with same sail area and other minor changes.
He basically has the mechanical skills and contacts, while i am more into the optimization of spaces, restoration interior/textile design having now completed my master in architecture. We would like to flip it to eventually sell it for a bigger one in a year or 2. ... What are your precious thoughts on this CS-27 1978 boat, fully equipped, we ...
1978. 27'. 9'4'. 5'9'. Outside United States. $9,995. Description: I have owned this boat for 25 years and always kept it well maintained. The list of equipment is only a partial listing as there are many more parts and accessories included.
The CS 27 is a great boat. I have sailed ICE on Lake Superior for 5 years now. It can take the bigger winds they pop up and has a deep cockpit. Being one of the heavier 27 foot boats, it is slower in very light winds. the single cylinder horizontaly mounted engine is a bit rough and noisey. We are usually on e ofthe forst to put up the sails ...
The CS 27 is a very robust blue water design (Raymond Wall), capable of big waters. It is excellent for a single handed or a couple wanting to enjoying cruising in a very economical boat. Many many upgrades have been done, including electrical. Vessel registered in Canada and USA import and duty paid complete.
Pro-25. A Judel/Vrolijk designed sportsboat built for sailors by sailors. High tech construction in vacuum bagged Epoxy with carbon stifferning. Rudder, ... PRICE: $22,500 CAD. YEAR: 2006. LENGTH: 26 feet. Ocean Yacht Sales is Atlantic Canada's premier sailboat and powerboat brokerage. Our extensive listings include new and pre-owned ...